2 Pages with MBS

Mark Brackett is a psychologist and professor at Yale University, known for his groundbreaking work in emotional intelligence and the impact of emotions on daily life. He is the founder and director of the Yale Center for Emotional Intelligence. Through his book, “Permission to Feel,” and his work at Yale, Marc helps others give themselves permission to feel, and teaches them to create a safe space for emotional exploration. Get book links and resources at http://2pageswithmbs.com and subscribe to the 2 Pages newsletter at https://2pageswithmbs.substack.com. Marc Brackett reads two pages from “7 ½ Lessons about the Brain” by Lisa Feldman Barrett. [reading begins at 11:57] Hear us discuss: "Emotions are signals to approach or avoid. People's facial expressions, body language, and tone all send signals. I wanna be with you, I don't wanna be with you. I like you, I don't like you, I respect you, I don't." [20:12] | "All emotions are information. The idea that there are good and bad emotions is a myth. Emotions are a product of things happening in our body and mind, based on our life experiences." [25:54] | "Just because you have a proclivity to experience strong emotions like anxiety or frustration doesn't mean you're not good at dealing with it or labeling it. It just means that you have a tendency to feel that way more." [26:47] | "We're endlessly making predictions based on what's going on inside of us and what we're observing in the world around us. That's our emotional life." [36:59] | "The core of this work is that concept that we have to give ourselves the permission to be our true, full, feeling selves, nonjudgmental, compassionate, self-scientists." [38:30]

Jay Papasan is the best-selling author of The One Thing, which has sold over 3 million copies and appeared on numerous bestseller lists. Jay's career trajectory has been a series of evolutions, from working in publishing at HarperCollins, to freelance writing, to finding a deep expression of his mission to create impact working in collaboration with Gary Keller. Jay's journey exemplifies the courage and (useful) restlessness to pursue a calling and make a difference in the world. Get book links and resources at http://2pageswithmbs.com and subscribe to the 2 Pages newsletter at https://2pageswithmbs.substack.com. Jay reads two pages from “Turning Pro” by Steven Pressfield. [reading begins at 27:25] Hear us discuss: “When we wrote The One Thing, what became really clear from the success stories is that the people that achieve the most, the businesses that achieve the most, the athletes, the artists, were driven by some inner drive.” [12:16] | “If I'm focused on impact, whatever I'm working on has to matter to me and others. And I don't define the scope of others, because that's a trap.” [21:28] | "Sometimes, when we're terrified of embracing our true calling, we pursue a shadow calling instead. That shadow career is a metaphor for our real career." [29:51] | “The first question we ask is, when someone finishes this book that we haven't written yet, what's the first thing they're going to say about it? And what's the first thing they're going to do differently?” [43:12] | “The things that come with maintaining success are not what got you there.” [52:24]

Amy Elizabeth Fox is a transformative figure in the realm of leadership development and personal growth. As the co-founder and CEO of Mobius Executive Leadership, she brings a unique perspective to the field, emphasizing the importance of inner transformation for effective leadership. Get book links and resources at http://2pageswithmbs.com/ Amy reads two pages from Attuned by Thomas Hübl. [reading begins at 23:03] Hear us discuss: "Trauma energy creates a filter over our perception. Where we are traumatized, our perception of the world is distorted and limited. Awareness is reduced and overshadowed." [26:51] | "Genuine healing has the power to restore distortions and bring about inner and outer coherence, including improved relationships." [27:24] | "In precision is love. Being precise about who you're talking to and present." [30:15] |"We need to get rid of the bifurcation of a leadership development path with the cultivation of spiritual, psychological, and spiritual intelligence. They can't be two separate things." [39:15] | "We naturally care about each other. We naturally care about the world we live in. It's only a traumatized society that doesn't take that as a premise." [40:47]

It's not just our tech-enabled world that runs by algorithm. We meat machines, we humans, we one and all have our own programming, our deeply embedded rules that determine the decisions we make, the paths we walk, and who and how we show up in the world. Often the first part of growth and development is figuring out what our rules are, finding language for our own programming. The second part of growth and development is often unbugging the program and rewriting the maxims, so you become the person you want to be rather than the person you once were. So, here are three rules, three algorithms, three maxims that I bet you haven't considered, at least not fully. Number one, don't wait until you know who you are to get started. Number two, learn to take a punch. And number three, the ordinary plus extra attention equals the extraordinary. Each one of these is taken from a different book written by our guest today, Austin Kleon. Get‌ ‌book‌ ‌links‌ ‌and‌ ‌resources‌ ‌at‌ https://www.mbs.works/2-pages-podcast/ Austin Kleon is a prolific writer and artist known for his innovative approach to creativity and self-expression. He is the author of several bestselling books, including "Steal Like an Artist," "Show Your Work," and "Keep Going." Austin reads two pages from “What It Is” by Lynda Barry. [reading begins at 49:24] Hear us discuss: The importance of finding inspiration and guidance from mentors and teachers in one's field."The great thing about dead masters is they can't refuse you as a student."  [36:18] | The significance of community and how it can shape one's creative journey. [21:25] | The impact of encountering individuals who open doors to new creative possibilities. [42:31] | The value of simplicity and restraint in creative work. "Creativity is subtraction." [49:12] | The power of self-reflection and questioning in the creative process. "Is this good? Does this suck?" [50:14] | The transformation from enjoying creative work to feeling pressure and self-doubt. [50:45] | The importance of maintaining a sense of play and joy in creative endeavors. [51:53]

With the new year, we’re doing something new with 2 Pages with MBS. Twice a month, you can listen in to the same excellent conversations, and we’ll also be dedicating a YouTube channel and newsletter to the show. With that said, I didn’t want to leave you without anything to tide you over until February. In this episode, I read from Seth Godin’s book, “Purple Cow,” and ask you the question: are you going to sit out the next round, or will you be a Purple Cow? [Reading begins at 05:25] Get access to full transcripts and past episodes at https://www.MBS.works/podcast

Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages Do you have a posse of people with whom you create “good trouble?” A small group you can collaborate with to stir the pot, strengthen one another, and step to the edge of what you think is possible? I often wrestle with how to build that type of relationship, and what I should bring to the table as a member. In this interview, we not only get an inside look at relationship building but also, how to identify and overcome the stress that can make us less effective collaborators. Get‌ ‌book‌ ‌links‌ ‌and‌ ‌resources‌ ‌at‌ https://www.mbs.works/2-pages-podcast/  Modupe Akinola is a professor at Columbia Business School, host of the TED Business Podcast, and part of a trio of ladies who set the standard for creating “good trouble.” Modupe reads two pages from the Genesis, the first book of the Bible. [reading begins at 30:52] Hear us discuss: The elusive definition of stress, as given by a stress expert. [00:04:30] | The key factors that create stress in your life: "The demands of a stressful situation can exceed your resources to cope, leading to feelings of stress." [00:05:09] | The first step in addressing the stress: "Noticing your physical and mental state when faced with stress can help you better manage it." [00:06:16] | How to take control and shift your mindset to overcome current stressors. [00:07:02] | Why having stress matters: "Every stressful situation is an opportunity to build resources and overcome future challenges." [00:10:52]

Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages Today, we're pulling one of our best episodes from the vaults, featuring the brilliant Dave Stachowiak. A famous quote by Albert Schweitzer talks about how small and obscure deeds are far more powerful than public acts that receive acclaim. It goes: ‘[The public acts] were like the foam on the waves of the deep ocean.’ Applying this metaphor to the world of leadership, what’s just foam on the waves, and what’s the sinuous currents of the deep ocean?  A great podcast that I often listen to - and one that I have been a guest on four times - is Coaching for Leaders, hosted by Dave Stachowiak. This podcast is the portal for his Coaching for Leaders Academy, which helps managers and executives develop leadership excellence. Dave is someone who, I think, is a masterful surfer: he knows the foam and the waves, but he also knows the deep ocean. Get‌ ‌book‌ ‌links‌ ‌and‌ ‌resources‌ ‌at‌ https://www.mbs.works/2-pages-podcast/  Dave reads two pages from ‘How to Win Friends and Influence People’ by Dale Carnegie. [reading begins at 20:55]  Hear us discuss:  “Talk to the people listening.” [11:21] | ‘We all think we’re more polarised than we actually are.’ [26:29] | Staying present to discomfort. [30:24] | The structure of the Coaching for Leaders Academy: “We learn best when we’re struggling with something.” [37:50] | Finding struggle to keep learning: “Seeing your mistakes is one of the most important parts of the learning process.” [40:13]

Today, we're pulling one of our best episodes from the vaults, featuring the brilliant Stephanie Harrison. Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages Christmastime in Australia is in mid-summer. The Northern hemisphere traditions of ugly sweaters, roasted meats, and roaring fires really just don’t vibe there. We’ve even got a Christmas carol about Santa’s sleigh being pulled along by kangaroos, rather than reindeer. Many years ago, on a hot Christmas day, my family packed a picnic and headed for Tidbinbilla, the nature reserve about an hour’s drive away. When we arrived, we laid out all the food, hung up some wind chimes, and set up a table and chairs in the middle of a river. Sitting there, eating my mum’s plum pudding with the water flowing by waist-deep, with my family - I knew I was happy.  Of course, happiness is elusive. The stories and expectations we’ve internalised about the requirements to achieve happiness are mostly illusions. Stephanie Harrison is a champion for a wiser path to happiness, or as she calls it, The New Happy. Get‌ ‌book‌ ‌links‌ ‌and‌ ‌resources‌ ‌at‌ https://www.mbs.works/2-pages-podcast/  Stephanie reads two pages from ‘The Way of the Bodhisattva’ by Śāntideva. [reading begins at 12:40] Hear us discuss: The reluctance to give back to others: “The path to experiencing fulfilment and well-being is the ways in which we relate to other people.”  [16:15] | The process of learning to serve. [20:06] | Transcending ‘The Eye.’ [24:48] | Is happiness always a spiritual practice?: “Spirituality is about helping us to be human.” [27:28] | Self-care and self-renewal. [34:35]

Today, we're pulling one of our best episodes from the vaults, featuring the brilliant Dr. Robyne Hanley-Dafoe. Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages What’s the language you go to when you think of resilience? Common answers include, ‘bouncing back,’ ‘bouncing forward,’ ‘what doesn’t kill you makes you stronger,’ or ‘a regathering of yourself.’ I truly believe that the words and metaphors we choose to use around resilience actually influence how accessible that resilience is, to us. Get‌ ‌book‌ ‌links‌ ‌and‌ ‌resources‌ ‌at‌ https://www.mbs.works/2-pages-podcast/  Dr. Robyne Hanley-Dafoe has spent two decades researching, teaching, and advocating for simple and powerful language around resilience, and the way she puts it is beautiful; resilience is being okay.  Robyne reads two pages from ‘Man’s Search for Meaning,’ by Viktor Frankl. [reading begins at 20:35]  Hear us discuss:  “The weight of the world becomes heavy to carry with two hands.” [4:02] | Describing resilience: “Resiliency is a verb.” [6:44] | Unlearning what’s ‘normal.’ [24:49] | What to unlearn about resilience: “Stoicism is not resiliency.” [27:36] | Getting better at falling apart: “Mistakes are not characteristics.” [29:57]

Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages One of my favorite songs is Hole In The Bucket by Spearhead, the band fronted by Michael Franti. It’s the story of someone walking along and deciding whether or not to give to someone else asking for a dime, for a nickel, for a quarter. As we approach the holiday season, perhaps you’re wrestling with the same challenge as I am - what does it mean to be charitable? How altruistic are you willing to be? In this interview, there’s a twist on that; one that might change everything. Get‌ ‌book‌ ‌links‌ ‌and‌ ‌resources‌ ‌at‌ https://www.mbs.works/2-pages-podcast/  Charlie Bresler is the volunteer executive director of the nonprofit organization The Life You Can Save, and he’s truly been central to it becoming a force.   Charlie reads two pages from ‘The Life You Can Save’ by Peter Singer. [reading begins at 20:25]   Hear us discuss:  Keeping the connection to your values alive. [8:58] | The relationship between structural change and individual change. [15:11] | A combined view of humankind: “I look around the world and I despair, but I also look at human potential and I’m optimistic.” [27:13] | Overcoming your natural selfishness: “It is a missed opportunity to not see the incredible amount of pleasure you can get from saving lives and helping other people.” [28:21] | The challenges of running a nonprofit. [32:04] | Effective hedonism rather than effective altruism: “You don’t have to be an altruist.” [37:51] | The meaning of success. [40:38]

Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages I remember being in New Orleans some years ago where people were offering to read your palm and tell your future. I was interested – I’d like to know how the future pans out. So, I picked somebody, and she proceeded to provide an amazingly disappointing performance that was mostly a combination of boring, wrong, and clichéd. I didn’t get my $20 worth, but what if you could see the future? What would you want to know, and what would you not want to know? Jonathan Brill is an author and a speaker, but perhaps he’s also the oracle that I’ve been seeking. He is, according to his business card, a Futurist. For the first years of his career, his focus revolved around innovation and what products would shape the future. But then he accepted a new role in a new organization, which he assumed would be more of the same. Irony alert – turns out the future wasn’t as predictable as he thought. Get‌ ‌book‌ ‌links‌ ‌and‌ ‌resources‌ ‌at‌ https://www.mbs.works/2-pages-podcast/    Jonathan reads two pages from ‘The Medium Is the Massage’ by Marshall McLuhan. [reading begins at 17:05]   Hear us discuss:  Understanding the shape of a question. [8:13]| Three tips for community building. [11:19] | How to stay engaged, yet be removed. [23:13] | “There are three conversations to have about any situation with another person; What happened? How do we feel about it? And What Happens Next?” [28:15]  | System observation and pattern recognition: “If you have a process for looking at the future, you can know a whole lot more than you imagine.” [30:19]  | Jonathan’s book, Rogue Waves: “How do I increase my optionality and potential, no matter what happens?” [36:59]

Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages Are you living for 70 years, or are you living the same year 70 times? It’s one of the great existential questions that writers and creators face, too – Am I writing many books, or am I writing the same book many times? Sure, the “best” answer seems obvious, but I’m not sure the true answer is always clear-cut. Malcolm Galdwell made popular a study that showed the difference between two great artists, Picasso and Cezanne; there’s deep and there’s wide, and it’s an eternal rhythm. Get‌ ‌book‌ ‌links‌ ‌and‌ ‌resources‌ ‌at‌ https://www.mbs.works/2-pages-podcast/ Geoff Dyer is a real writer. He’s the award-winning author of four novels, as well as numerous non-fiction titles on D. H. Lawrence, understanding photography, yoga, and more.  Geoff reads two pages from ‘The Country and the City’ by Raymond Williams. [reading begins at 23:45]   Hear us discuss:  The relationship between photography and writing. [6:33] | “Write the book that only you can write.” [11:47] | Self-expression as a learnt practice: “I became a very original writer by being incredibly susceptible to influences.” [11:53] | “The writing life is full of surprises.” [35:06] | The most important lessons in writing. [36:53]

Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages So how are politics going in your country? ... No, no, don't tell me - you're just delighted with how your version of democracy is currently showing up. ... I am truly feeling the pain and the confusion. And the inadequacy, of course, not knowing what to do about it right now. But what if in the future the good guys win? And if you knew that you were one of the good guys - and I think you are - what would that call forth from you?  On Rob Hopkins’ website there is a photo of him holding a sign that says, ‘I've been to the future…’ Rob is a father, a husband, a speaker. He's an author, he's an artist. He's a gardener. And perhaps central to all of that. He is an activist. Rob co-founded Transition Network and also Transition Town.  Rob reads two pages from ‘We Do This ‘Til We Free Us’ by Mariame Kaba. [reading begins at 13:50]   Hear us discuss:  “We need to build what I like to think of as being an imagination infrastructure.” [3:32] | How to sustain energy as an activist. [6:09] | The power of ‘What if?’ [11:41] | “And the only reason we're going to do it is if we're able to talk about what the radical transformation of society would be like in a way that is so irresistible and delicious and magnificent that of course, we want to do that.” [18:50] | “What does it mean to be someone whose work unlocks different possibilities and different ways of thinking about the future?” [21:03] | The goal of enlightenment is to free others. [26:41] | “The kind of activist [anyone] can be is entirely something that they shape themselves and is a reflection of what they're passionate about and what they care about and what they grieve for and what delights them.” [39:40]

Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages ‘The map is not the territory.’ This is one of those obvious yet profound insights: the thing we use to try and understand reality, is not reality. It’s true for all charts in companies, for instance. While they tell you a lot, they don’t have all the answers. Your map of the world, what does it tell you and what does it not?  Tiziana Casciaro is Professor of Organizational Behavior at the Rotman School of Management at the University of Toronto, and co-author of the book Power, for All: How It Really Works and Why It’s Everyone’s Business.  Tiziana reads two pages from ‘The Heart is Noble’ by the 17th Karmapa, Ogyen Trinley Dorje. [reading begins at 26:25]   Hear us discuss:  The study of the nonobvious. [6:33] | “When you have a lot of power imbalance, in the long run, bad things tend to happen.” [13:46] | The challenges and consequences of power in organizational spaces. [15:11] | “The world would be infinitely better if we were all more aware of how interdependent we are.” [33:03] | Power for all: “Sharing power doesn’t mean giving up power, it means empowering others.” [37:00] | Moving from certainty to ambiguity: “Remind yourself of the good in you so that you will be able to appreciate the good in others without fearing they will take over.” [42:33] | How human behavior is influenced by context. [46:41]

Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages What was your first dream that felt big? The first time you set your eyes on something and thought, ‘I’d like to strive for that.’ Or, on the flip side, ‘I’m not accepting the status quo anymore, something needs to change.’ You were probably young, and though the motives may have not been entirely clear to you, it was a moment of stepping up and claiming your authority; of claiming the next best version of you.  Olatunde Sobomehin is the co-author of the book Creative Hustle, and the CEO at StreetCode Academy, a community-based tech ecosystem that’s preparing the next generation of underrepresented tech leaders with everything from basic computing to virtual reality.  Olatunde reads two pages from ‘The Life We’re Looking For’ by Andy Crouch. [reading begins at 17:45]   Hear us discuss:  “I grew up in an environment where you could believe in the impossible.” [2:13] | What to say ‘yes’ to. [5:43] | How to start betting on your gifts. [8:48] | Dealing with resistance: “Holding onto your principles in moments of resistance is what keeps you grounded.” [12:05] | The notion of being known: “We’re all looking to be known in life.” [22:18] | The power of a shift in mindset. [27:38] | What it takes to reach out and ask for help. [32:36]

Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages I did a beginner’s class in ceramics earlier this year, and it was a pretty interesting experience to go up against a potter’s wheel and lose. Forget actually trying to create a pot, I found it nearly impossible just to get the lump of clay centered on the wheel. I did end up with a few lumpy, bumpy things to glaze - and glazing is its own adventure where you never really know how your project will turn out since every firing in the kiln is different. Do your best, create blindly, have your creation tempered by forces beyond your control, and end up with something unexpectedly gorgeous. Gosh, it’s a bit like life, really.   Susan Collett is someone I’ve shared a glass of wine with more than once on my balcony, as she lives just around the corner from me in Toronto. She also happens to be one of the pre-eminent artists who works in clay sculpture and printmaking, something she’s been doing successfully for 30 years.  Susan reads two pages from ‘The Creative Habit’ by Twyla Tharp. [reading begins at 14:15]   Hear us discuss:  What art does for the artist, and for the world: “Something good always comes forward out of chaos, difficulty, and struggle, and I want to remind people of their strength amidst fragile times.” [6:32] | How to engage with art. [8:52] | Planning helps the wheel go ‘round. [17:59] | Working through the doldrums as a creator. [20:01] | Our inner critics: “Just because you think it, doesn’t mean it’s real.” [21:52] | The importance of drawing. [25:55] | The next project: “Within one piece there are ten other pieces.” [27:31] | “The clay, itself, teaches you to let go into the materials.” [30:01] | How to find your audience. [33:49]

Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages I often get asked how I sold more than a million copies of The Coaching Habit. I wish I had one, but, of course, there is no singular answer - just a combination of things going well and a healthy dose of magic fairy dust. One thing we got right, though, is the design of the book itself. So many books feel heavy - a wall of text - and I wanted a book that felt lighter, accessible, and non-intimidating. In whatever you’re working on, what experience are you creating?  Stefan Butcher is an acclaimed graphic designer and illustrator who likes designing books, and questions. When I found him through his wonderful book, 344 Questions: The Creative Person’s Do-It-Yourself Guide to Insight, Survival, and Artistic Fulfillment, I already knew we would get along. Get‌ ‌book‌ ‌links‌ ‌and‌ ‌resources‌ ‌at‌ https://www.mbs.works/2-pages-podcast/   Stefan reads two pages from ‘The Salmon of Doubt’ by Douglas Adams. [reading begins at 19:35]   Hear us discuss:  Disrupting the status quo: “I’m weird … but I’m not a threat to anybody, I’m just trying to make my thing happen and help others do the same.” [9:23] | Performative competence versus embodied competence. [13:29] | How to keep your heart open: “It’s not the pain that kills you, it’s the numbness.” [24:22] | The difficult choice of what to work on. [28:40] | The essence of collaboration: “We are each other’s keeper.” [33:31]

Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages As I’m recording this, I’m currently in Australia where we’re about two weeks out from a national referendum on whether or not to change the Australian Constitution to recognise the first peoples of Australia, by establishing a body called the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice. I’m embarrassed to say that it doesn’t look likely to pass, and by the time you’re hearing this we’ll know for sure. There’s a profoundly worrying general lack of energy and empathy among most Australians, and, to me, feels like a once-in-a-generation opportunity for reconciliation, empowerment, and healing is being missed. It’s confronting to recognise that so many of us live on unceded territories of First Nations, and it’s not easy to know what to do about it. That’s why I’m so grateful to the people doing the work to give the rest of us the chance to do the right things, and make the braver choices.  Bob Joseph has been steadily changing the world for decades. He’s the President and CEO of Indigenous Corporate Training Inc, a company focused on teaching others how to work effectively with those people who are native to Canadian land, and also the author of a perpetual best-seller in Canada, 21 Things You May Not Know About The Indian Act. Get‌ ‌book‌ ‌links‌ ‌and‌ ‌resources‌ ‌at‌ https://www.mbs.works/2-pages-podcast/  Bob reads two pages from ‘BE DiFFERENT or be dead’ by Roy Osing. [reading begins at 32:15]   Hear us discuss: What reconciliation looks like: “It took us 137 years to get into this mess, and I’m hoping it won’t take us 137 years to get out of it.” [14:54] | The three selves: self-determination, self-government, and self-reliance. [17:00] | “A lot of people doing a lot of little things adds up to a pretty big change.” [40:03] | Knowing when to take control, and when to let it be. [40:59] | How to stay patient: “Watch for the little victories and celebrate those.” [45:08]

Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages The very first hotel that I got quarantined into, I looked out over Darling Harbour in Sydney. I knew just over the rise was the Sydney Opera House. It was my only view for two weeks. It changed constantly. It was on fire, lit up by a sunset. It was looming with threat as a storm passed by. It became lit up at night. It was actually a Ferris wheel, a carnival, like an underworld at my feet. We're constantly searching for what's new. We're constantly distracted. And sometimes it's wonderful to be forced to look and look again at what's right there in front of you.  Miranda Keeling trained as an artist, initially with a degree in glass making, but has gone on to grace the big stage and to attack the tyranny of the blank page. Seeing small differences is Miranda’s thing; noticing the details of everyday life and elevating them with the various forms of art that she makes. And to be honest, this is something Miranda's done from the very start.  Miranda reads two pages from Mr. Rabbit and the Lovely Present by Charlotte Zolotow. [reading begins at 14:54] Hear us discuss: What do you have to let go of to fully embrace the identity of being a writer? [8:36] | Writing and courage: “You're not swept along by somebody else's agenda in the same way you've got to set your own agenda, you've got to go into wherever you work and start and look at that blank page and it's a very different way of being.” [11:16] | “The simple things that you might not notice are the things that could be the most important.” [18:23] | How to ‘slow down’ and get in tune with your thoughts: “There's a meditation technique I did years ago, and I sometimes do still where you imagine that your mind is a blank theater and the curtains are open and you just wait to see what comes onto the stage. You try not to follow it or get too emotionally entangled, but you notice the players move across the stage.” [26:40] | Elevating the ordinary: “In the hot shop, there'd be lots of debris left over from [the glass blowers’] work, and I would take that glass debris from the floor and use it in my pieces… And my point being that's, again, me taking something pretty ordinary. … And I'm trying to get the best I can out of it and elevate it into something else.” [32:42]

Recommend this show by sharing the link: pod.link/2Pages What does it take to be an ambassador, to be a diplomat? …If you had to list three core characteristics, what do you think they should be? Now, for me, part of me goes all espionage... You know, it's about blending in. It's about staying skeptical, perhaps wearing tweed. Part of me, of course, thinks of my brother Nigel, who actually works for the Department of Foreign Affairs in Australia and has actually played ambassadorial roles in Ankara, Turkey and in Berlin. Now, Nigel is the soul of discretion. He has a deep curiosity, also not that much tweed. But after this conversation, which you're about to listen to, a conversation where I realized that perhaps we all play the role of a diplomat and wondering if the key skills are actually empathy, rebellion, and a good left hook.  Tom Fletcher is the principal of Hartford College in Oxford University. …I invited Tom because in his lifetime, he's been a diplomat and also a writer and a campaigner. But along the way, there were several things he was not, or at least not successfully. “Having felt evangelical about the importance of diplomacy,” Tom says, “I left diplomacy to write a book about why diplomacy matters so much and looking particularly at the way that technology is changing statecraft. That was The Naked Diplomat [which] came out in 2016, and that did well. So I then got to write two more books. 10 Survival Skills for a World in Flux is about the future of learning… And then in August, I put out my first novel, which was called The Ambassador…” Get‌ ‌book‌ ‌links‌ ‌and‌ ‌resources‌ ‌at‌ https://www.mbs.works/2-pages-podcast/ Tom reads two pages from The Ministry for the Future by Kim Stanley Robinson. [reading starts at 17:25] Hear us discuss: “But I guess all that adds up to this conclusion that education is upstream diplomacy. And that basically, if I want to make a real influence on the future of the country and the planet, then actually being here, developing young people, head, hand and heart is where I should be.” [4:07] | “A great diplomat, it’s about the last 3 feet, as Edward Murray said. It's about that ability to really understand the person you're talking to, know what baggage they arrive in the room with, and to almost zoom out of a situation in a room and use that empathy to understand what's going on.” [6:32] | Modern-day trends, including the rise of distrust, which makes it harder to govern. [24:05] | Ten skills for the future, including taking control of your life and becoming an active participant in shaping the future. [27:03] | “And here, because of the way the power structures work, it's much more important to lead from behind. Much more of it is about setting the tone, the sense of the overall direction and letting then the strategy emerge, rather than trying to dictate some sort of top down.” [32:40] | “There is space for hope.” [37:35]