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Emotional Sobriety: The Next Step in Recovery
Emotional Sobriety: The Next Step in Recovery
Allen Berger & Thom Rutledge

Bill Wilson, co-founder of Alcoholic's Anonymous, wrote in 1952, "If we examine every disturbance we have, great or small, we will find... more

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What Aren’t We Thankful For?

Our resistance to change and our inability to properly feel grief is connected on some levels to a lack of... more

26 Nov 2023 · 40 minutes
On the Rocks

Patience and practice are what Thom, Allen, and now Patrick attempt to bring to bear in a set of sudden... more

19 Nov 2023 · 33 minutes
“There Ain’t No Easy Cancer”

Thom returns to the pod to bring Allen and Patrick up to speed on his last few challenging months, and... more

06 Nov 2023 · 43 minutes
New Recovery From Trauma and PTSD

Allen and Joe C. delve their personal experiences with trauma in trying to highlight how these principles of Emotional Sobriety... more

22 Oct 2023 · 42 minutes
Recovery in Poetry with Janine McJannett

RTT (Rapid Transformational) Therapist, Hypnotherapist and coach Janine McJannet has spent the better part of her life reckoning with the... more

16 Oct 2023 · 41 minutes
Daily Practices on Recovery's Frontier (with Patrick McAteer)

Having flourished in his connection to others through the use of Zoom and WhatsApp during the pandemic, Friendly Circle Berlin... more

09 Oct 2023 · 49 minutes
Oh, the Places We’ll Go (with Joe C.)

Allen and Joe find an unlikely Emotional Sobriety kindred spirit in Dr. Seuss' "Oh, the Places You'll Go," a classic... more

25 Sep 2023 · 53 minutes
Emotional Sobriety in Residential Treatment

Melanie Gulde, program director of the soon-to-open Divided Sky residential recovery retreat located in Ludlow, Vermont, drops by discuss her... more

17 Sep 2023 · 35 minutes
It’s Never Too Late

In a later season of her life, Susan Chandler had to reckon with the collapse of a marriage, unemployment, the... more

10 Sep 2023 · 45 minutes
Awakening Our Truest Selves

To be loved, to be accepted, and to belong, we early in life construct an identity that, as Allen describes,... more

30 Aug 2023 · 44 minutes
Surviving and Thriving in Motherhood with Celeste Yvonne

Celeste Yvonne, certified recovery coach and author of It’s Not About the Wine: The Loaded Truth Behind Mommy Wine Culture... more

14 Aug 2023 · 49 minutes
Self-Esteem and Emotional Sobriety with Roger Andes

Therapist Roger Andes, longtime friend and frequent collaborator on Thom and Allen’s 12-Step workshops, drops in to discuss his latest... more

07 Aug 2023 · 40 minutes
Recovery's Paradoxes

Living peacefully with the irreconcilable is at the core of what creates change. Thom and Allen alternately draw upon their... more

03 Aug 2023 · 51 minutes
Keeping Cool with Carol Carter

On a weekend of record heatwaves, to escape the crushing anxiety Thom and Patrick invite longtime collaborator Carol Carter on... more

17 Jul 2023 · 50 minutes
Change Calls the Tune We Dance To

As much as we strive to cultivate our emotional sobriety, learning to lean on self-support rather than environmental support, those... more

09 Jul 2023 · 26 minutes
Let Fear Be Your Teacher

Health care and financial insecurity are just a couple of the subjects Thom, Joe, and Patrick touch on as they... more

26 Jun 2023 · 54 minutes
Emotional Sobriety & Self-Respect

What does it mean to respect ourselves, and how can we put it to work once we’ve attained some physical... more

12 Jun 2023 · 44 minutes
Every Life Is Worth a Novel

Allen references Erving Polster’s book while contemplating how the broad span of our lives have a dramatic richness and fullness... more

05 Jun 2023 · 33 minutes
Depression's Long Game

Picking up with Thom Rutledge about his recent struggles with depression, something that’s been with him since his early days... more

29 May 2023 · 39 minutes
Freedom at Cost

The team unpacks their month of hard knocks and give their best shot at illustrating how life's heaviest challenges can... more

21 May 2023 · 47 minutes
Shifting to the Best Possible Attitude

Part of our mission statement as we move towards greater emotional freedom is to have the best possible attitude towards... more

01 May 2023 · 22 minutes
A New Way of Making Amends

Foundational to Emotional Sobriety is the recognition that we aren’t bad people trying to be good people. We’re simply trying... more

23 Apr 2023 · 27 minutes
When the Road Meets the Rubber

Decades after his service in the Vietnam War, Allen realized the extent of his disability and trauma after a chance... more

15 Apr 2023 · 20 minutes
When the Rubber Meets the Road

With some inspiration from W. Timothy Gallwey’s The Inner Game of Tennis (one of the only self-help books Thom has... more

10 Apr 2023 · 30 minutes
True Acceptance

Brian Lutz and Thom Rutledge recently encountered critical challenges in their marriages that tested their capacity for acceptance. Acceptance of... more

03 Apr 2023 · 46 minutes
The Decision Maker

Locating our authentic self in the midst of our warring inner committee and standing our ground - not against others... more

27 Mar 2023 · 36 minutes
Emotional Sobriety, Stewardship & Service (Part Two)

A we engage with the recovery impetus to be of service to others, In addition to the reward there may... more

20 Mar 2023 · 37 minutes
Emotional Sobriety, Stewardship & Service (Part One)

Recovery (and Emotional Sobriety) are contagious! Joe Chisholm returns to the pod to chat with Thom and Patrick about the... more

13 Mar 2023 · 48 minutes
A New Perspective on Failure

As we become more awakened in emotional sobriety, we begin to challenge all our old ideas. The power struggle of... more

06 Mar 2023 · 42 minutes
Authentic Values

How can we learn to live in better alignment with our values? Some of our values are unconscious, and benefit... more

27 Feb 2023 · 44 minutes
Ripple Effect

Thom and Allen hold down the fort to discuss the role of honesty in therapy. Allen shares the profoundly positive... more

19 Feb 2023 · 32 minutes
“Maddiction” with Joe C.

It feels good to judge. What does that reveal about ourselves, and how can we work on putting this energy... more

13 Feb 2023 · 47 minutes
Radical Honesty

Thom and Allen discuss what it means to be "radically honest." Radical honesty begins with self-honesty. We can’t do it... more

05 Feb 2023 · 44 minutes
Practice Makes Practice

Thom and Patrick dig into their rocky pre-recovery days, charting the evolution their consciousnesses have taken. While encountering challenges, keep it... more

30 Jan 2023 · 31 minutes
Philosophy over Psychology with Tom Potash

Allen and Thom welcome longtime contributor to the Emotional Sobriety community Tom Potash to talk about his decades-long recovery journey,... more

23 Jan 2023 · 57 minutes
A Spiritual Path Through Emotional Sobriety

Recovery stalwart Richard Warner had to announce himself as a newcomer after decades in the program, a formative experience that... more

16 Jan 2023 · 57 minutes
Living Consciously with Roger Andes

Roger Andes discusses his body-oriented work as a therapist, cultivating connections with others and within himself revolving around the preservation... more

09 Jan 2023 · 52 minutes
Meditating on the New Year with Herb Kaighan

Longtime collaborator, first-time guest Herb K. joins us to discuss the role of meditation in his daily practice, and how... more

30 Dec 2022 · 45 minutes
More Will Be Revealed with Joe C.

This week we share our thoughts on receiving & offering guidance to other addicts across a wide span of experience... more

19 Dec 2022 · 47 minutes
Higher and Friendly Powers with Dr. Peg O’Connor

Peg joins us to talk about her more secular conception of a Higher Power, informed by her background in philosophy... more

12 Dec 2022 · 55 minutes
Our Inner Civil War

If you’re disturbed about something, we encourage investigating what’s beneath that disturbance. This episode we explore the psychological mechanism called... more

05 Dec 2022 · 42 minutes
The Importance (and Difficulty!) of Our Daily Practice

With the serenity prayer, we try to figure out the things in our lives that we have the power to... more

28 Nov 2022 · 34 minutes
Thanksgiving Survival Guide

In preparation for the forthcoming high calorie sit-downs many of us are having with friends and family this week, Allen... more

23 Nov 2022 · 35 minutes
The Holidays: Come As You Are

Allen’s big Italian dinners. Thom getting kicked by a horse. Patrick learning what to do with his hands, now that... more

14 Nov 2022 · 45 minutes
Between Wisdom & Discipline

At a certain point (or maybe various points) along the recovery way, we each develop an awareness of what we... more

06 Nov 2022 · 51 minutes
Thom & Allen at the ICSAA

Allen tells us about his formative years enlisting in the marines, Vietnam, alcohol and drugs. Thom of early struggles working... more

30 Oct 2022 · 1 hour, 18 minutes
Making the Most of Fellowship & Support

Let's return to fundamental questions of what Emotional Sobriety is, and why we consider it the “next frontier." How do... more

23 Oct 2022 · 37 minutes
What Progress Am I Making?

How can we measure our progress (or lack there of) in productive ways? Learning to separate from self-condemnation & create/embrace... more

16 Oct 2022 · 1 hour,
Room for All

Let’s exercise more authority and agency over our lives. Moving towards a focus on being rather than having. A bit of... more

09 Oct 2022 · 50 minutes
Living in the Moment

Let’s talk about how essential the practice of living in the moment is to the condition we call emotional sobriety.... more

03 Oct 2022 · 37 minutes
A New Self-Esteem

Defining a self-esteem based on humility and an appropriate estimation of ourselves, our successes and failures. Cultivating this newfound sense... more

26 Sep 2022 · 40 minutes
Secular Recovery with Joe C.

Author and podcast host Joe C. of Rebellion Dogs Publishing joins Allen and Thom to discuss a “yes, and” rather... more

19 Sep 2022 · 53 minutes
Managing Anxiety with Gina Ryan

We’re joined this week by Gina Ryan, who in her work with clients and on her weekly podcast imparts some... more

11 Sep 2022 · 54 minutes
Emotional Sobriety at Work

In observance of Labor Day, let’s talk about how to keep our emotional center of gravity in an environment that... more

03 Sep 2022 · 37 minutes
What Love Is

Allen and Thom reunite after some time off for labor and travel. Today we spend some time digging into intimacy... more

28 Aug 2022 · 39 minutes
Neutralizing Fear

From relapses to climate catastrophes to dropping the ball at work, fears of both the immediate and existential varieties assert... more

14 Aug 2022 · 1 hour, 1 minute
Recovery 2.0 with Tommy Rosen

Allen's conception of recovery as a consciousness of freedom meets Tommy's holistic recovery approach that doesn’t shy away from the... more

07 Aug 2022 · 55 minutes
Getting Disappointments to Work for Us

The pursuit of greater emotional sobriety can allow us to mobilize our disappointments to take action in our lives, rather... more

31 Jul 2022 · 24 minutes
Overcoming Disappointments

How we react to the disappointments we face in our relationships, in ourselves, and our politics is at the heart... more

23 Jul 2022 · 44 minutes
Integrating Role Models

From parents to found families to George Washington, Thom and Allen delve into lessons learned from various mentors throughout their... more

17 Jul 2022 · 50 minutes
Emotional Sobriety: The Next Step in Recovery
Secular Recovery with Joe C.
Emotional Sobriety: The Next Step in Recovery

Listen now on

Apple Podcasts
Google Podcasts
Podcast Addict
Pocket Casts
Player FM
Podcast Republic


Author and podcast host Joe C. of Rebellion Dogs Publishing joins Allen and Thom to discuss a “yes, and” rather than “no,... more