Let's Talk About Sects

A little update from Sarah about what to expect with Let's Talk About Sects now that we're winding up the sixth season of the show. Don't worry, we're not going anywhere! But there are a few small changes to make sure that this project remains sustainable.

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In the last episode of season 5, we looked into a Boulder, Colorado community then known as Divine Madness and led by Marc Tizer, usually referred to as 'Yo'. Its members were recognised for some amazing results in ultramarathons. At the time of researching that episode, updates about the current status of the group were hard to come by.

Deru Youmans came across a listing for 'The Retreat' in the Gila National Forest on the Worl...

Journalist Emma Lehman is the creator of the independent podcast Gooned, which dives into the Troubled Teen Industry or TTI – a network of for-profit congregate care facilities for youth ranging from wilderness programs to therapeutic boarding schools. In the podcast, Emma interviews survivors, parents, staff members, experts and activists.

Across the USA, young people are funnelled into this $23 billion industry not only b...

Harry Palmer created Avatar after his presidency of the Church of Scientology's Elmira Mission ended in the mid-1980s, as a result of legal proceedings around trademark infringement. Avatar says that it aims to create an 'enlightened planetary consciousness' or EPC through its courses, which are expensive and numerous. Former students say they have been left with massive debts as a result of their attendance.

Full research sourc...

Thomas Parsons joined the Twelve Tribes community in Hiddenite, North Carolina in April 2019, and left in November 2021. With Hiddenite being the unofficial headquarters of the organisation, he had direct contact with a number of senior leaders of the Tribes. Following last week’s live episode release, this conversation with Thomas provides an interesting insight into some of the more recent developments in the communities, as well...

This episode was recorded live at Woodford Folk Festival on 1 January 2024. Many people in the audience would have come across the Twelve Tribes previously at that very festival, as they used to build a big Common Ground cafe by the lake where tens of thousands of festival-goers ate and drank over the years.

Numerous wonderful people have devoted themselves to the communities and the lifestyle of the Twelve Tribes. Thousands of ...

Matson Browning is a law enforcement officer who, along with his wife Tawni, spent years undercover infiltrating various hate groups to research and report on the rise of hate crimes and white supremacy in the United States. Together they wrote the book The Hate Next Door: Undercover Within the New Face of White Supremacy, which was published in July 2023.

What others dismissed as fringe groups, Matson quickly recognised as...

Yaakov Aharon and Shula Kirovsky’s lives in Sydney’s famous beach suburb of Bondi were lived largely separate from mainstream society, within the Chassidic sect of Chabad. Their families’ lifestyles were a world away from the fashionable bikini and boardshorts-wearing demographics usually associated with the area. Though Yaakov disconnected himself from the sect’s beliefs while he was still quite young, as a teenager he remained ke...

Rachel Bernstein is an LA-based therapist who has specialized in cult intervention and re-acclimation for over 30 years. She serves on the advisory board of the International Cultic Studies Association and has worked with the Department of Justice providing support to cult survivors. Over the years she has made many media appearances as a cult expert and is also the host of IndoctriNATION, a weekly podcast covering cults,...

Xenos was originally set up as a leaderless group that rejected the structures and trappings of mainstream churches. Springing forth from the Jesus Movement of the late 1960s and early 1970s, it focused on meeting in people’s homes and embracing members from the youth counter-cultures. So why does the church’s own website admit to a history that involves cult-like behaviour? And how did it come to face allegations of manipulation a...

Xenos was originally set up as a leaderless group that rejected the structures and trappings of mainstream churches. Springing forth from the Jesus Movement of the late 1960s and early 1970s, it focused on meeting in people’s homes and embracing members from the youth counter-cultures. So why does the church’s own website admit to a history that involves cult-like behaviour? And how did it come to face allegations of manipulation a...

In many ways, this theatre troupe and Fourth Way school became the most secretive this podcast has looked into yet. Most members didn’t know each other’s jobs, marital status, or even surnames. They didn’t see each other outside of what they referred to as ‘the work’, they didn’t know the classes they were going to each week had anything to do with the teachings of Russian philosophers, and they didn’t tell anyone outside what it w...

Andrew Pledger was raised in the Independent Fundamental Baptist movement, and after completing his homeschool education, attended Bob Jones University. He is the creator of the limited podcast Surviving Bob Jones University: A Christian Cult. His podcast explores the school’s history, the psychology of fundamentalism, the criteria for cults, and survivors’ experiences.

Full episode page here. You can support us on Patreon ...

Sarah is a cult survivor, domestic violence survivor, and a survivor of trafficking and modern slavery. She wouldn’t have been able to name these things as she was experiencing them, or even for some time in the aftermath. Like many cult survivors, Sarah can draw a line between the coercive behaviours that she experienced in the high-demand organisation she was brought up in, KwaSizabantu, and the coercive behaviours of those who a...

Carol Merchasin spent many years as an employment lawyer. She has also been a partner in the Philadelphia office of Morgan, Lewis & Bockius and director of Morgan Lewis Resources. She has conducted dozens of workplace investigations and taught investigative techniques to human resource professionals at many Fortune 50 companies. She has since joined McAllister Olivarius, where she heads up a practice covering sexual misconduct...

Lisa Kendall spent the ages of 9-19 in The Move of God, Sam Fife's apocalyptic cult. Today, she devotes her time to working on policy changes that will help former cult members and children in high-demand organisations. For International Cult Awareness Month 2023, she updates us about her work with Counter Cult Coalition and the work of others in the counter-cult space.

Full episode page here. You can buy Joe Gould's LTAS soundt...

Guinevere Turner grew up in The Lyman Family, a group she now understands was a cult, but at the time was the only family she knew. Guinevere has recently released her memoir When the World Didn't End. In it, she recounts her childhood experiences, including the abusive family situation she found herself in when she was pulled out of the cult. She spoke with Sarah about her book, as well as the work she's doing now to help others w...

Gloriavale Christian Community has been in the news recently in New Zealand for court cases around labour and servitude, and there are further cases happening as well. To understand more about the history of the organisation, you can listen to our 2-part episode about the group. Rosanna Overcomer recently celebrated 10 years out of Gloriavale, at the end of March 2023, and shares some of her story and the work she does now to help ...

Divine Madness Running Club boasted some spectacular results in ultramarathons and became known for their excellent support teams and low-impact style of running. But the Boulder, Colorado based group was also notorious for their strange ways, whereby members were expected to follow the directions of their teacher in all aspects of their lives.

UPDATE: Deru Youmans had a more recent experience with Marc Tizer (Yo), through a lis...